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 Assassin 65 Goto page 1, 2  Next
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CathyW
Master

Joined: 31 Jan 2007
Posts: 161
Location: Hertfordshire, UK

 Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2007 3:25 pm    Post subject: Assassin 65 Excellent puzzle - kept me occupied most of this afternoon despite a few early placements (it's OK I wasn't skiving, had a day off work!) Was stuck for quite a while before my step 20. Looking forward to the variations. Prelims: a) 41(7) @ r3c4  no 1,3 b) 4(2) r67c4 and r34c6 = {13} not elsewhere in c4, c6 -> NP {13} r6c4 + r4c6 not elsewhere in N5 c) 24(3) N3 = {789} not elsewhere in N3 d) 8(3) r12c7+r2c6 = {125/134} must have 1 in r12c7 not elsewhere in c7/N3 -> 9(3) N3 = {234} not elsewhere in N3 -> r12c7 = {15} not elsewhere in c7 -> r2c6 = 2 -> r3c9 = 6 -> r4c89 = {29/38/47} -> 2 locked to r3c78 not elsewhere in r3 -> 2 locked to r45c4,r5c5 of 41(7) -> r46c5 <> 2 e) 19(3) r345c1 and r9c456  no 1 f) 21(3) r89c3 + r8c4  no 1,2,3 1. Outies c789: r28c6 = 6 -> r8c6 = 4 -> r89c7 = {27/36} 2. Outies c123: r28c4 = 12 = [48]/{57} 3. Innies r12: r2c258 = 13 = {19/46}3 / {18/36}4 4. Innies r89: r8c258 = 10 = {127/136/235} 5. O-I N9: r7c9  r6c8 = 3 -> r7c9 = (45789), r6c8 = (12456) 6. Outies c1: r169c2 = 16 7. Outies c9: r149c8 = 24 = {789} not elsewhere in c8 -> r4c9 <> 7,8,9 -> 12(3) r9c8+r89c9 = [714], 8{13}, 9{12} -> r89c9 = (1234) ({723} would block both options for r89c7) -> 1 locked to r89c9, not elsewhere in c9/N9 8. Innies c5: r159c5 = 11 = {128/137/146/236/245} If {128/137/146} r1c5 = 1 -> r1c5 <> 7, 8 If {137} r5c5 = 7 -> r9c5 <> 7 9. O-I N1: r2c4 + r4c2 - r3c1 = 4 -> r4c2  r3c1 = 0 or -1 or -3 10. O-I c12: r37c3  r5c2 = 3 11. O-I c89: r37c7  r5c8 = 9 Max from r37c7 = 13 -> r5c8 is max 4 -> 6 locked to r678c8 of 21(4) -> r7c7 <> 6 r5c8 = (1234) -> r37c7 = 10, 11, 12, 13, r3c7 = (234) -> r7c7 is min 7 12. 21(3) r89c3 + r8c4 = [948]/{579/678} 13. 16(3) r12c3 + r2c4 = {39/57}4 / [29]/{38/47}5 / {18/36/45}7 14. Outies N14: r2c4+r7c1 = 8 = [44/53/71] -> r7c1 = (134) 15. 9 locked to r8c13, not elsewhere in N7 -> r8c3 <> 5. 16. 8 locked to r8c134 -> r9c3 <> 8 17. Killer Triple: Split 10(3) in r8 c258 = {127/136/235} (each option has 2 of 1,2,3), r8c9 = (123) -> r8c17 <> 1,2,3 -> r9c7 <> 6,7 18. 15(3) r1c456 = {168/348/357/456} ({159} blocked by r1c7) 15(3) contains one of 5,8 -> 17(3) r234c5 <> [854] 19. 21(4) r678c8+r7c7 must have 5 and 6 within r678c8 -> 21(4) = 56+{19/28/37} -> r67c8 <> 4 -> r7c9 <> 7 (step 5) -> 4 locked to r79c9 not elsewhere in c9 -> r4c8 <> 7 20. 9 locked to r4569c4 -> r7c6 <> 9 9 also locked to r569c6 (Grouped x-wing) -> r7c5 <> 9, r9c8 <> 9 -> r89c9 <> 2 -> 2 locked to r456c9 not elsewhere in N6 -> r7c9 <> 5 -> 5 locked to r56c9 -> r6c8 <> 5 -> r7c9 <> 8 21. 16(3) r567c9 = {57}4 / {25}9 ({39}4 blocked by r89c9) -> r56c9 <> 3, 8, 9 -> 8 locked to r12c9 -> r1c8 <> 8 22. Looking at 3s to eliminate 3 in common peer cell r7c8 a) if 3 in r23c8 -> r7c8 <> 3 b) if 3 in r3c7 -> 3 locked to r12c5 -> r7c4 = 3 -> r7c8 <> 3 Either option r7c8 <> 3 23. Looking at 3s to eliminate 3 in common peer cell r8c8 a) if 3 in r23c8 -> r8c8 <> 3 b) if 3 in r3c7 -> r3c6 = 1 -> r4c6 = 3 -> r4c9 = 2 -> 16(3) = {57}4 -> r89c9 = {13} -> r8c8 <> 3 Either option r8c8 <> 3 24. Revisiting 21(4) options now: 56{19/28} -> r7c7 <> 7 25. Split (10)3 r8c258 cant now be {136}  blocked by r8c9 Remaining options {127/235} 26. Looking at 6s to eliminate 6 in common peer cell r6c5 a) r6c8 = 6 -> r6c5 <> 6 b) r7c8 = 6 -> 6 locked to 41(7) within N5 -> r6c5 <> 6 Either option r6c5 <> 6 27. 17(3) r678c5 = {179/269/278/359/368/458/467} If {359} r6c5 = 9; if {458} r6c5 = 4 -> r6c5 <> 5 28. 19(3) r9c456 must have 9. Options: {289/379} -> r9c456 <> 5,6 -> 5,6 locked to r9c123 not elsewhere in N7 -> r8c1 of 15(3) is min 7 -> r9c12 <> 7,8 -> HS r8c7 = 6 -> r9c7 = 3 -> r8c9 = 1 -> r9c9 = 4 -> r9c8 = 7 -> lots more singles and reasonably straightforward with cage combos and singles from here Last edited by CathyW on Sat Sep 01, 2007 9:44 am; edited 2 times in total
Para
Yokozuna

Joined: 08 Nov 2006
Posts: 384
Location: The Netherlands

 Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2007 10:18 pm    Post subject: Hi all Here's my walk-through. Was a fun puzzle. Check out step 26. That was a fun one and it also broke the puzzle for me. Hope i can find some time for Ruud's variations. Walk-Through Assassin 65 1. 8(3) at R1C7 = {125/134}: no 6,7,8,9 2. 24(3) at R1C8 = {789} -->> locked for N3 3. 19(3) at R3C1 and R9C4 = {289/379/469/478/568}: no 1 4. 41(7) at R3C4 = {2456789}: no 1,3 5. R34C6 = {13} -->> locked for C6 6. R67C4 = {13} -->> locked for C4 6a. Naked Pair {13} in R4C6 + R6C4 -->> locked for N5 7. 21(3) at R8C3 = {489/579/678}: no 1,2,3 8. 45 on C123: 2 outies: R28C4 = 12 = {48/57}: no 2,6,9 9. 45 on C789: 2 outies: R28C6 = 6 = {24} -->> locked for C6 10. 45 on N3: 1 innie and 1 outie: R2C6 + 4 = R3C9 -->> R2C6 = 2; R3C9 = 6(only possible combo) 10a. R8C6 = 4 10b. Clean up: R2C4: no 8(step 8) 11. 8(3) at R1C7 = 2{15} -->> R12C7 = {15} -->> locked for C7 and N3 11a. 17(3) at R3C9 = 6{29/38/47}-->> R4C89 = {29/38/47}: no 1,5 11b. 13(4) at R8C6 = 4{27/36} -->> R89C7 = {27/36}: no 8,9 12. 45 on N7: 1 innie and 1 outie: R7C1 + 4 = R8C4: R8C4 = {578} -->> R7C1 = {134} 13. 45 on C9: 3 outies: R149C8 = {789} -->> locked for C8 13a. Clean up: R4C9: no 7,8,9 13b. 12(3) at R8C9 = {129/138/147}: {237} blocked by R89C7; {345} blocked by R9C8 -->> R89C9 = {12/13}/[14]: no 5,7,8,9; 1 locked for C9 and N9 14. 45 on N9: 1 innie and 1 outie: R6C8 + 3 = R7C9: Min R6C8 = 1 -->> Min R7C9 = 4, R7C9 = {45789} -->> R6C8 = {12456} 15. 21(4) at R6C8 = {1569/2469/2568/3459/3468/3567}: other combos blocked because {789} only in R7C7 -->> 21(4) needs one of {789} and can only go in R7C7 -->> R7C7 = {789} 16. 5 in C9 locked within 16(3) cage at R5C9 -->> 16(3) = {259/358/457} 17. 45 on N9: 3 outies: R56C9 + R6C8 = {139/148/157/238/247/256/346} = {39}[1]/{48}[1]/{57}[1]/{38}[2]/{47}[2]/{27}[4]/{25}[6]/{34}[6] -->> R6C8 = {1246}: no 5 17a. Clean up: R7C9: no 8(step 14) 17b. R56C9 = {57/38/47/25}: {39/48/27/34} blocked by 16(3) at R5C9: no 9 -->> R6C8 = {126}(step 17): no 4 17b. Clean up: R7C9: no 7 18. 21(4) at R6C8 = {1569/2568/3567}: {2469/3459/3468} blocked by R23C8(cant have 2 of {234} in R678C8): no 4; 6 locked within R678C8 -->> locked for C8; 5 locked within R78C8 -->> locked for C8 and N9 18a. Clean up: R6C8: no 2 19. 16(3) at R5C9 = {25}[9]/{57}[4]; R56C9 = {25/57}: no 3,4,8 20. 4 in N9 locked for C9 20a. 8 in C9 locked for N3 20b. Clean up: R4C8: no 7 21. 45 on R89: 3 innies: R8C258 = 10 = {127/136/235}: no 8,9 21a. 9 in R8 locked for N7 22. 45 on N7: 3 innies: R7C1 + R89C3 = 17 = [197/395]/[3]{68}/[4]{58}/[4]{67} -->> R9C3: no 4 22a. 21(3) at R8C3 = {579/678} -->> 7 locked within cage : R8C12: no 7 22b. R7C1 + R89C3 = [4]{58} blocked by 21(3) cage at R8C3 -->> R8C3: no 5 23. 45 on N8: 2 innies and 2 outies: R6C45 + 1 = R7C6 + R8C4: Min R7C6 + R8C4 = 11 -->> Min R6C45 = 10; Max R6C45 = 12 -->> Max R7C6 + R8C4 = 13: R6C45 = [19/37/38/39]; R7C6 + R8C4 = [65]/{57}/{58}/[67] = {5|6..}-->> R6C5 = {789}; R7C6: no 9 24. 19(3) at R9C4 = {289/379}: {568} blocked by R7C6 + R8C4: no 5,6; 9 locked for R9 and N8 24a. Killer Pair {78} in 19(3) at R9C4 + R9C8 -->> locked for R9 24b. Clean up: R89C9: no 2(13b); R8C3: no 6; R8C4: no 5(step 22a) 24c. Killer Pair {78} in R8C4 + 19(3) cage at R9C4 -->> locked for N8 25. R7C6 + R8C4 = [57/58/67](step 23) 25a. R6C45 = [38/39](step 23 + 24c) -->> R6C4 = 3; R6C5 = {89} 25b. R34C6 = [31]; R7C4 = 1; R2C8 = 3(hidden) 25c. Naked Pair {24} in R3C78 -->> locked for R3 26. LOL on N5: R3C4 + R7C6 = R46C5 -->> R3C4 = {89}; R4C5 = {56}(this works because the 41(7) cage contains exactly the same digits as the remaining 7 empty cells in N5) 26a. 17(3) at R2C5 = [485/476]: {179} blocked by R4C5 -->> R2C5 = 4; R3C5 = {78} 27. 6 in N2 locked within 15(3) at R1C4 -->> 15(3) = {168} -->> R1C5 = 1; R1C46 = {68} -->> locked for R1 and N2 27a. R12C7 = [51]; R3C45 = [97]; R2C4 = 5; R4C5 = 6 27b. R2C9 = 8(hidden); R7C6 = 6(hidden); R1C46 = [68]; R6C5 = 9(hidden) 27c. R9C6 = 9(hidden); R8C4 = 7(step 25) 28. R9C45 = {28} (step 24) -->> locked for R9 and N8 28a. R9C8 = 7; R1C8 = 9; R4C8 = 8; R14C9 = [73]; R89C9 = [14]; R7C79 = [89] 28b. R6C8 = 6(step 14) 29. 15(3) at R8C1 = [9]{15}/[8]{16} -->> R8C1 = {89}; R9C12 = {156} 29a. Naked Triple {156} in R9C123 -->> locked for R9 and N7 29b. R89C7 = [63]; R7C1 = 3(step 12)(missed this earlier); R8C2 = 2 29c. R78C5 = [53]; R78C8 = [25]; R3C78 = [24]; R5C8 = 1 30. 14(3) at R1C1 = {239/347}: no 6; R1C2 = 3(only place in cage) 30a. R5C3 = 3(hidden) 31. 13(3) at R6C1 = 3[28] -->> R6C12 = [28] And the rest is all naked singles greetings ParaLast edited by Para on Sat Sep 01, 2007 12:52 pm; edited 1 time in total
Ruud
Site Owner

Joined: 30 Dec 2005
Posts: 601

 Posted: Sun Aug 26, 2007 8:34 pm    Post subject: I promised a few variations on Assassin 65. A65V2 Tough, but no hypotheticals (guesses) needed. 3x3::k:2816:2816:4354:3587:3587:3587:4614:5383:5383:2816:4874:4354:4354:3085:4614:4614:2320:5383:5650:4874:4874:10005:3085:1559:2320:2320:3098:5650:4874:4893:10005:3085:1559:6689:3098:3098:5650:4893:4893:10005:10005:10005:6689:6689:3116:3117:3117:4893:1840:4913:10005:6689:4916:3116:3117:3127:3127:1840:4913:10005:4916:4916:3116:4671:3127:5185:5185:4913:4676:4676:4916:4167:4671:4671:5185:1867:1867:1867:4676:4167:4167: A65V3 hot hot hot, probably needs some creative moves (guesses) 3x3::k:4352:4352:4354:4099:4099:4099:2310:3591:3591:4352:3082:4354:4354:3853:2310:2310:3856:3591:3858:3082:3082:10261:3853:3095:3856:3856:5658:3858:3082:4637:10261:3853:3095:5921:5658:5658:3858:4637:4637:10261:10261:10261:5921:5921:3628:4397:4397:4637:2608:2865:10261:5921:4148:3628:4397:4663:4663:2608:2865:10261:4148:4148:3628:3903:4663:3649:3649:2865:5444:5444:4148:3143:3903:3903:3649:3147:3147:3147:5444:3143:3143: This will keep you busy for the remainder of the week. Ruud_________________If the human brain were so simple that we could understand it, we would be so simple that we couldn't. - Emerson M Pugh
CathyW
Master

Joined: 31 Jan 2007
Posts: 161
Location: Hertfordshire, UK

 Posted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 2:48 pm    Post subject: Hmmph! Can't say that the V2 is a fun puzzle. Haven't got very far at all. Anyone else tried it? Don't think I'll be attempting the V3!
Howard S
Regular

Joined: 20 Aug 2007
Posts: 10
Location: Amsterdam

 Posted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 3:34 pm    Post subject: I have had 2 goes at the V2 and both times I thought I had cracked it only to find a conflict right at the end. I have been waiting to read a walk thru from one of the experts to see what I have done wrong but no one has posted one. So, at the risk of being deemed stupid, here is one that does not give the answer, but I would be interested to know where the logic fails!!!! Deleted and replaced belowLast edited by Howard S on Thu Aug 30, 2007 8:28 am; edited 2 times in total
Para
Yokozuna

Joined: 08 Nov 2006
Posts: 384
Location: The Netherlands

 Posted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 5:40 pm    Post subject: Hi Howard I ran into an inconsistency on my first run through. Still have to start my second attempt, but i'll check your walk-through. greetings Para
CathyW
Master

Joined: 31 Jan 2007
Posts: 161
Location: Hertfordshire, UK

Posted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 9:47 pm    Post subject:

 Howard S wrote: 34 locked in C5 N2 => Cage 12/3 C5 <> 921 =>R5C5=9

I have a problem with this step! Still have a 4 in r3c6 unless I missed something.

Last edited by CathyW on Thu Aug 30, 2007 10:04 am; edited 1 time in total
Para
Yokozuna

Joined: 08 Nov 2006
Posts: 384
Location: The Netherlands

 Posted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 9:59 pm    Post subject: Hi Cathy I send the same message to Howard. greetings Para
Howard S
Regular

Joined: 20 Aug 2007
Posts: 10
Location: Amsterdam

 Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 4:58 am    Post subject: Cathy/Para Thanks for your help and pm's - unfortunately I have to go to work today so will check your points out later - but it seems my typing needs some work! I have corrected the typos you highlighted and made the logical error point you raised bold so that anyone who looks knows that from that point on the logic is incorrect. Howard
mhparker
Grandmaster

Joined: 20 Jan 2007
Posts: 345
Location: Germany

 Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 8:33 am    Post subject: Hi all, How's everybody getting on with the V2 or - dare I mention it?! - the V3? After a fairly quick response from Howard, and judging by the length of his posted partial WT, I was expecting a full WT to be posted shortly afterwards. I guess from this that Howard must have made a logic error fairly early on, thus invalidating most of the later steps? If it's proving to be more difficult than expected, maybe it should have been done as another tag team effort. From what I've seen of the V2 so far, it looks quite interesting (didn't at first, but does now, after finding one or two more creative moves). A good idea would probably have been to start the tag by initially posting the steps Howard used up to the logic error. Maybe Cathy, Para (or others) could have then quickly added the steps they found that Howard missed. As it is, the time's almost up, and A66 is soon to be thrusted upon us. Having said that, I guess there's nothing preventing us continuing with either puzzle after A66 is on the scene. Heck, it's even got the advantage that we can avoid the pain of having to write everything in tiny text , or openly talk about techniques used (shock, horror! )... Lastly, just a quick piece of info for Howard: please make sure you number the steps in any WT/partial WT you post, so that we can conveniently refer to them in any posts of our own. Many thanks._________________Cheers, Mike
Howard S
Regular

Joined: 20 Aug 2007
Posts: 10
Location: Amsterdam

 Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 8:34 am    Post subject: I have taken into account your comments and had another unsuccessful attempt at V2. Any help with the below would be much appreciated. Hopefully no more typo's 1 Cage 7/2 N8 = {124} 2 Outies C789=> R2C6+R8C6=16={97} 3 Outies C123=> R2C4+R8C4=15={87I96} 4 Outies N14=>R2C4+R7C1=10=[91I82I73I64] 5 39/7 N258=98763{42I51} 6 97 Locked in R345C45 7 97 cannot be both in C4=> R5C5=9I7 8 => 19/3 C5 <>3 9 => 3 in R7 locked in N8 10 => R7C1<>3 => R2C4 <>7 => R8C4<>8 11 Cage 6/2 C6 = {42I51) 12 Cage 7/2 C4 =[16I25I43] 13 Combinations on R2C46 & R8C46 => 9 locked in R8C46 14 => R78C5= 2 of 5678 15 => Cage 19/3 C5 = {8{74I65}} 16 Rule 45=> R159C5=14=>R1C5=1,3,4,5,6 17 Cage 14/3 R1 <>97=>{851I842I653} 18 Cage 12/3 C5 = {921I741I732I651} 19 => R1C5 <>56 (as Cage 19/3 C5 = 865 with all except 651) 20 => 3 Locked in C6 R567 => R345C4 <>3 21 => Cage 7/2 C4 = [43] => Cage 19/3 C5 = {865} => R8C46={97} 22 =>R2C4<>9 R7C1<>1 23 => Cage 12/3 C5 <> {651} =>97 locked in C5R2345 24 => Cage 39/7 = 9876531 25 => 3 locked in C5 N2 26 97 Locked in C4 R3458Last edited by Howard S on Thu Aug 30, 2007 11:15 am; edited 4 times in total
CathyW
Master

Joined: 31 Jan 2007
Posts: 161
Location: Hertfordshire, UK

 Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 10:01 am    Post subject: Sorry Howard. I think there's still a problem here! After the placements at r67c4 you state: => cage 19(3) c5 = {568} => r8c46 = {79} Fine so far but then r2c4 <> 8 - how?! At this point, I have r2c4 = 6 or 8 which rather negates the step beginning 97 locked in c4r3458 as it cannot lead to placement of 6 in r2c4 at this stage. I've conceded defeat and just run it through JSudoku. Apparently requires 2 Grouped Turbot Chain with 5 links and 32 Conflicting Partial Combinations amongst many other steps. It's beyond me (despite my now acquired "Expert" status")!!! PS With A66 coming within 24 hours I think we can take things out of tiny text and I would agree with Mike about numbering steps if possible! PPS If anyone is feeling masochistic enough, here's the stats from JSudoku for the V3! 74 Naked Singles 5 Hidden Singles 5 Naked Pairs 3 Hidden Pairs 2 Complex Hidden Singles 1 Naked Triplets 7 Intersections 9 Odd Pairs 27 Odd Triplets 3 Double Innies & Outies 1 Odd Quads 9 Complex Intersections 6 Mandatory Inclusions 8 Triple Innies & Outies 2 Double Outies minus Innies 2 Complex Naked Pairs 17 Conflicting Combinations 2 Complex Hidden Pairs 5 Quadruple Innies & Outies 3 Triple Outies minus Innies 1 Pointing Triples 1 Complex Naked Triplets 31 Conflicting Partial Combinations 8 Multiple Innies & Outies
Howard S
Regular

Joined: 20 Aug 2007
Posts: 10
Location: Amsterdam

 Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 10:27 am    Post subject: Cathy Sorry these typos are dreadful - see revision to line 22 Howard
CathyW
Master

Joined: 31 Jan 2007
Posts: 161
Location: Hertfordshire, UK

 Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 10:35 am    Post subject: OK - that's better! Still struggling to follow line 26 though. Can you explain please.
Howard S
Regular

Joined: 20 Aug 2007
Posts: 10
Location: Amsterdam

 Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 11:13 am    Post subject: Cathy It is rubbish I will delete from 26 down This is beginning to get to me!!! Not sure I have earned my upgrade to Rookie Howard
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